INTERVIEW是美國波普藝術大師安迪沃荷（Andy Warhol）創辦的雜誌，這篇採訪裏談到了23歲的MJ的眾多朋友：簡方達、凱薩琳赫本、戴安娜羅斯、麗薩米內莉、斯皮爾伯格，以及他的偶像詹姆斯布朗、卓別林等等；他對音樂、對表演在那個年齡已經有了深刻的理解，其後我們看到貫穿了他的一生。那個時候的MJ，正在製作那張空前絕後的THRILLER，和眾多藝術史上的名人過從甚密，是媒體的寵兒，前方有整個世界等著他去征服。
INTERVIEW雜誌網站上只保留了其中談藝術的部分，其他的大部分內容也很有意思。
邁克爾傑克遜的私人世界安迪沃荷、鮑勃克拉塞羅，1982年8月20日 ，星期五，下午3:30
鮑勃克拉塞羅來到位於聖費爾南多的一個山谷裏的邁克爾傑克遜居住的公寓。由於他們自己的房子在裝修，邁克爾和他的家人暫時租借在這裏。邁克爾，這位人盡皆知的JACKSON5的主唱，也已經為他的獨唱生涯打下了堅實的基業。他的上一張專輯《瘋狂》僅僅在美國就已經售出500萬張。儘管他仍然和他的兄弟們一起錄製唱片，現在他們的名字叫JACKSONS，邁克爾也開始和一些超級巨星合作，例如保羅麥卡特尼、昆西鐘斯、戴安娜羅斯和斯蒂文斯皮爾伯格這些人都成為了他的密友。在等待正在紐約的安迪沃荷的來電的時候，鮑勃和MJ開始聊起他的另一個朋友：簡方達。
MJ：亨利方達去世的那天晚上，我趕到那兒去和他們的家人待在一起。他們正在談論翻看各種歌詠的新聞報導。儘管她的父親去世了，簡仍然對我的事業很感興趣，問我是否找得到了那部電影，讓我覺得非常貼心。我想很久以前就與預期到他的去世了。很多很多很多個月以前，她談起這事就如同這可能發生在任何時候。當它確實發生了，他們有時候流淚，有時候也歡笑，還吃了一點兒東西。
BC：那麼你在幹什麼？找到了一部電影玩玩嗎？
MJ：我正全力完成我的專輯，同時也在做另一張專輯《ET》，那張專輯對我來說挺新鮮的，因為我還從來沒有講述過一個故事。
BC：這《ET》是個什麼專輯？
MJ：是個故事專輯，雙張的。我會在裏面講述整個故事，還要唱一首我根據這個故事寫的歌。我剛剛和斯蒂文（斯皮爾伯格）談過，我們碰了頭，談了不知道有多久，說要將它做成一張空前的專輯。
BC：你正在做的那張專輯呢？你寫了裏面所有的歌嗎？
MJ：我寫了四到五首歌。
BC：斯蒂夫（魯貝爾）（著名的54俱樂部的創始人，譯注）告訴我，你正在和保羅麥卡特尼合作？
MJ：是的。保羅正好在這兒，我寫了了一首歌《那女孩是我的》，我們會在我的專輯裏一起唱這首歌。我們在歌裏為一個女孩爭鬥。我們一共合作了兩首歌，在各自的專輯裏都效果都很棒，他的那首歌叫《O War Part II》。但是在我的專輯裏唱的是我寫的歌。在歌裏最後我們為爭奪那個女孩還有一番唇槍舌劍，很好玩。
BC：你對於和別的明星合作很開放。一般人通常不這樣。
MJ：其實也不是，一點也不。
BC：你和戴安娜羅斯一起工作？
MJ:只和非常特別的人（合作）。我是說，戴安娜對我來說集母親、情人、朋友于一身。她太棒了。我剛剛為她的下一支單曲《肌肉》完成了寫作、製作和編曲。
BC：歌詞也是你寫的嗎？
MJ：歌詞、音樂（都是）——我剛剛寫完，這個月底就會發行了。
BC：你從哪兒擠出時間來寫這些東西？
MJ：在飛機上。我完成和保羅麥卡特尼的合作從英國回來，在協和飛機上飛馳，這首歌就跳到我腦海裏了。我說：“嘿，這太適合戴安娜了！”我沒有答錄機或別的什麼東西，於是只能忍了差不多三個小時。一回到家裏我就把這寶貝錄下來了。
BC：你關心政治嗎？
MJ：我不喜歡談論那些。
BC：你和簡（方達）在一起沒談到這些？
MJ：我們談過。她太棒了。她教會我許許多多事情。在《金色池塘》拍攝點的時候，我和簡住在一個小屋裏。小屋在水上，只有我們兩個人，我們成天聊天，聊天，聊所有的事情。那對我來說是最棒的教育——她學到了東西，我也學到了東西，我們還會互相爭辯。我們聊了各種各樣的事情，你想得到的都有：政治、哲學、種族主義、越南、表演，各種各樣的事情。那太神奇了。
BC：你在哪里接受教育呢？你總是在路上。
MJ：私人學校或者是導師。
BC：你來自印第安那的加里？在那裏長大是什麼感覺？
MJ：事實上，我那時候太小了，根本不記得。五歲的時候我就開始旅行、唱歌、跳舞了。永遠在外頭，永遠不在學校。我只記得街角的商店這些小事情和幾個鄰居。我家後面的高中有一隻很大的樂隊，他們吹著喇叭和長號，敲著鼓走過街道——我喜歡那個——就像遊行一樣。那些是我記得的全部了。
BC：你小時候喜歡表演嗎？一直都喜歡嗎？
MJ：一直喜歡。我一向喜歡在舞臺上的感覺——那裏是魔法的發生地。當我登上舞臺，那感覺簡直就像有魔力突然發生，靈感擊中你，而你也失去控制。
BC：你如何比較（在鏡頭前）表演和在舞臺上演出呢？
MJ：我都喜歡。表演是精華。我喜歡演出，那是一種驚人的出逃方式。如果你想要真的發洩出所有的情感，這正是時候。而表演，就像變成另外一個人。我覺得那很酷，尤其是你能渾然忘我。當你渾然忘我的時候——我喜歡那樣——那就是魔法產生的時候。我喜歡製造魔法——將那些東西放在一起，如此的不同尋常，出人意料，它能讓人們瘋狂。那些領先於時代的東西，比人們所想的還要遠走五步，人們看到會說：“哇哦，我真是沒想到！”我喜歡給別人帶來驚喜，無論是用禮物，用舞臺表演還是別的東西。我喜歡《歡迎歸來，科特》裏面的約翰屈伏塔。沒人知道他會跳舞，還有所有這些本事。他就像一顆炸彈。不久，他就會是下一個白蘭度了。
BC：他最近好像沒什麼東西。
MJ：我知道。我估計他在挑選劇本什麼的吧。與自己過去的成就競爭對任何人來說都是艱難的事情。
BC：告訴我，你認為哪些人在他們各自的領域是開創性的人物？
MJ：我太喜歡斯蒂文斯皮爾伯格了。我愛詹姆斯布朗，他是個現象。我從來沒有見過第二個像詹姆斯布朗一樣讓觀眾過電的表演者。他將每個人掌握在股掌見，無論他想讓他們怎麼做，他都做到了。這太神奇了。我一直覺得他被低估了。我愛小薩米大衛斯，我愛弗雷德阿斯泰爾，我愛喬治盧卡斯。我為簡方達和凱薩琳赫本而瘋狂。
BC：我見過一張你和凱薩琳赫本在金色池塘拍攝地的照片。
MJ：能認識她是我的榮幸。因為有很多人都是她不喜歡的——她會直截了當地告訴你。我第一次見她的時候，因為聽了簡灌輸給我的那些故事，都有些發抖。我都被嚇著了。但是她當天竟然就邀請我去晚餐。從那以後我們就成了朋友。她來（麥迪森廣場）花園看我們的演唱會——她這輩子看過的第一個演唱會，而且她還很喜歡。我們會打電話，她還給我寫信。她簡直太棒了。我去了她在紐約的家，她給我看斯賓塞屈塞最喜歡的椅子和他衣櫥裏的私人物品，還有他的那些小玩意。我覺得他很神奇。
BC：你喜歡老電影嗎？
MJ：哦，是的。那裏面有很多偉大的藝術，偉大的表演，偉大的導演和偉大的故事。那些比如《怒海餘生》、《孤兒樂園》、佛納甘神父和《小姑居處》這樣的電影簡直是令人難以置信。
BC：你怎麼不自己寫個故事呢？
MJ：我們現在就在做這個。我們幾乎是在開玩笑，昆西、史蒂文和我——但願我們能幹出點什麼來。史蒂文想要弄部音樂劇。
BC：你有興趣去百老匯演出嗎？
MJ：還沒有。我覺得音樂劇很鍛煉技巧，對於真正到達天賦的頂峰是最好的。你一路走來，終於到達頂峰，然後說：“這大概是我最棒的演出了。”令人悲傷的是，你卻不能捕捉保留下這一時刻。看看有多少被世界遺忘的演員和藝人，他們演出了，就僅止於此。但電影卻可以捕捉到，它們在全世界放映，永遠流傳。斯賓塞屈塞和和我可以通過他的表演產生共鳴。然而，在劇院裏卻失去了這麼多，太多了。歌舞劇也是一樣。想想我本來可以從所有那些藝人們那裏學到多少東西！那將真是超現實的。
BC：許多戲劇現在都被拍下來了，但是不每天晚上都拍。
MJ：那就是問題所在。演員會緊張，他現在正被拍著，一切都覺得不自然了。這就是我不喜歡百老匯的原因。我覺得那簡直是全心付出卻顆粒無收。我喜歡捕捉到表演，保留下來，然後再和全世界分享它們。
BC：看來讓你真正有動力的是想要娛樂大眾，取悅大眾。那麼關於名聲和金錢呢？你能想像默默無聞嗎？成名困擾過你嗎？
MJ：這些倒沒怎麼困擾我，除了有時候也會想要清淨。就好像你去看電影，你說：“今晚不會有人來煩我，我戴著帽子和墨鏡，我要好好享受這部電影。”結果你進到那裏，每個人都在看著你，瞪著你，到了電影的高潮部分，竟然還會有人拍拍你的肩膀所要簽名。你會覺得自己無處可逃。
BC：那是為什麼你要住在穀裏，而不是所有其他明星住的貝芙麗山的原因嗎？
MJ：是的，不過這裏也一樣糟。貝芙麗山更糟，他們會跑過去追星。
BC：你和你的父母非常親近。他們在洛杉磯也住在這兒嗎？
MJ：是的。我目前在樓上，我父親在辦公室。
BC：你的典型一天是怎樣的？
MJ：大部分時間都在做白日夢。我起得很早，然後為我要做的事情做好準備，寫歌啊什麼的，再計畫計畫未來。
BC：你對未來感到樂觀嗎？
MJ：是的，我總是喜歡提前做好準備，然後再去完成。
BC：麗薩米內莉是你的朋友吧？
MJ：我怎麼會忘了她呢！我為麗薩而瘋狂。把她加到我最喜歡的人的名單上去。我愛死她了。我們一起在電話裏八卦八卦再八卦。我最喜歡麗薩的就是，當我們在一起的時候，我們總在談論表演。我給她演示我最喜歡的舞步，她給我演示她的。她也是個終極的表演者。她有一種真正的神力。將來我想要喝她一起錄歌。我覺得像她那樣的人（的歌聲）應該能從廣播裏聽到，讓大家接受。她就是舞臺上的魔法
BC：你很關心時尚嗎？
MJ：不。我只關心我在舞臺上穿的服裝。你知道我喜歡什麼，對吧？我對日常的服裝沒有興趣。我喜歡穿上一件衣服或是演出服，然後看著鏡子裏的自己。寬鬆褲，一些真是很時髦的鞋，再加上一頂帽子，然後去體會裏面的個性對我來說這很好玩。
BC：你在日常生活裏也非常喜歡表演？
MJ：我太喜歡了。這是一種出逃，很好玩。變成另外一件東西，另外一個人簡直太酷了。尤其是當你信以為真，而不再是表演的時候。我一直就不喜歡“表演”這個詞，還有說“我是個演員”。這應該有比它大多了的含義。這應該簡直差不多是個信徒了。
BC：但是如果你完全相信的話豈不是太可怕了嗎？
MJ：不會，那正是我喜歡的。我就是喜歡徹底地遺忘。
BC：你為什麼這麼想遺忘？你覺得生活很艱辛嗎？
MJ：不，大概是因為我就是喜歡跳進別人的生活區探索一番。就像查理卓別林一樣，我愛死他了。那個小流浪漢，那一整套服裝道具，那所有的東西，還有他的心裏——他在電影裏塑造的一切都是再明顯不過的現實。那是他的整個生命。他出生在倫敦，六歲的時候父親就因酗酒而死，他的母親在精神病院裏。他在英國的街頭流浪、乞討，又貧困又饑餓。所有這些都反映在他的電影裏，這也正是我想做的，帶引出所有的真相。
BC：你關心賺錢嗎？
MJ：我只關心我的工作應該得到應有的回報。當我籌畫一個項目，我會全心全力投入。因為我真的喜歡，我會將我的所有都傾注在裏面，所以我希望得到回報。辛苦工作的人應該有飯吃，很簡單。
BC：你密切關注著自己的事務？
MJ：哦，是的。
BC：你幾歲了？
MJ：23。
BC：你一直都在成人世界裏表演，是否有時候會覺得好像失去了童年？
MJ：有時候。
BC：但是你喜歡那些比你年長的人，經歷豐富的人。
MJ：我喜歡經歷豐富的人。我喜歡那些有超凡天賦的人。我喜歡那些努力工作，充滿勇氣，成為他們行業領導者的人。結識那樣的人，向他們學習，和他們談話——對我來說，那簡直太夢幻了。對於一起合作的人，我為史蒂文斯皮爾伯格而瘋狂。我的另外一個靈感來源——我不知道從何而來——就是孩子。如果我覺得鬱悶了，我就會去找一本有孩子圖片的書，看著他們就能讓我重新振作起來。和孩子們在一起太神奇了。
BC：他們身上確實有某些積極而鼓勵人的東西。你還有很多動物對吧？
MJ：以前有很多。現在只有兩隻小鹿了，一個是男孩，一個是女孩。他們太乖了，太漂亮了。
BC：我難以理解人們怎麼能夠對鹿開槍。
MJ：我恨那個。我恨動物標本店和所有那些東西。我有一隻羊駝，還有一隻綿羊——他看起來就像長角的羊。路易，就是那只羊駝，來自馬戲團。那只羊叫蒂伯斯先生，兩隻鹿一個叫王子，一個叫公主。
BC：等他們長大了你打算怎麼辦？
MJ：放他們在院子裏玩。我們有大概兩英畝地。
BC：你的車是什麼樣的？
MJ：一輛勞斯萊斯，黑色的。
BC：那你喜歡開嗎？
MJ：我從來就不愛開車，是我父母逼著我開的。昆西就不開車，我認識的很多人都不開車。
BC：安迪（沃荷）也不開車。
MJ：明智之舉。不過當你想要一點點獨立溜出去的時候，那倒也不錯。只是我去的地方不多。我不知道太多地方，只是沿著馬路一直開。
BC：你不大出門？
MJ：我只去金廟，是一家健康食品餐館。我是一個素食者。或者還去遊樂中心玩遊戲。
BC：你對藝術感興趣嗎？
MJ：我喜歡畫畫，——鉛筆畫、鋼筆畫——我喜歡藝術。我們去荷蘭、德國還有英國巡演的時候都去過博物館——你知道哪些巨幅的畫作對吧？我簡直入迷了。我沒想到畫家可以做到那個程度。看著一座雕塑或是一幅畫，你簡直能沉迷進去。站在那個看著它們，你也化身為畫中場景的一部分了。它們能讓你流淚，能深深打動你。你看，那也是的對於演員和表演者的應該是什麼樣的想法的由來——他們應該接觸到一個人內裏的真實，應該深入地挖掘出真相，這樣這個人物才真正變成你的一部分，（在這個基礎上）你可以隨心所欲地發揮。你很快樂，他們（人物）也會快樂。不論人物的感情是怎樣的，他們就和在一起。我喜歡現實主義，不喜歡矯飾做作。在我們的內心深處其實都一樣。我們有著同樣的感情，這也是為什麼《ET》這樣的電影能打動每一個人。誰不想像彼得潘一樣飛翔？誰不想和那些來自外太空的夢幻生物一起飛翔，和他們做朋友？史蒂文能夠直指人心——他知道如果心存懷疑，那就深入到內心去。
BC：你是個教徒，是嗎？
MJ：是的。我相信《聖經》，我相信那個叫耶和華的神和所有的事情。
BC：有人說那就是你為什麼不刮鬍子的原因。
MJ：哦不！我沒有東西可刮，這兩者跟本沒有關係。
BC：那麼你是個基本的基督徒？
MJ：我相信事實。
BC：你看《聖經》嗎？
MJ：是的，經常看。
BC：你去教堂嗎？
MJ：我們不管那叫教堂，我們叫“王國堂”。(我是)耶和華見證會的。
BC：你提到明天要去見貝特米德勒？你們會一起合作嗎？
MJ：不是。我去見西斯裏格斯。我喜歡在唱歌時把嗓子完全打開，就像跳舞前的熱身。
BC：是不是就像呼吸課？
MJ：是的，我剛完成我的（練習），她（應是指貝特米德勒，譯注）就進來了，她總是很準時。
（此時安迪沃荷從紐約打電話來）
AW：喂？
MJ：嗨。
AW：上帝，這太令人興奮了。你知道，每次我用我的WALKMAN，都在放你的磁帶。
MJ：你最近見麗薩（米內莉）了嗎？
AW：是，我見了。她在歐洲，不過我在侯斯頓的時裝秀上見過她。她換了個髮型，現在她的頭髮看起來跟你差不多了。前面真的很卷，看起來也完全不一樣了，不過確實很可愛。她的新形象很棒。上個週末她去侯斯頓那裏，不過現在已經在紐約了。你怎麼樣？
MJ：我基本上都在工作室裏，寫歌詞，錄歌這些。
AW：我今晚也許會去麗茲看一個叫做杜蘭杜蘭的英國搖滾樂隊，你知道他們嗎？
MJ：不知道。
AW：我上個禮拜去Meadowlands看Blondie了。
MJ：Blondie怎麼樣？
AW：她很棒，很出色。你認識她嗎？
MJ：不，我從沒見過她。
AW：好吧，等你來紐約我會介紹她給你認識。巡演大概是世界上最艱難的事情了。
MJ：巡演有些像是——原地踏步。但是站在舞臺上是最夢幻的事情。
AW：我迫不及待想要看你真正做出一部大片了。他們跟你說要做什麼了嗎？
MJ：我的房間裏堆滿了劇本和邀請，許多都很不錯。但我是那種一旦認准想要合作的某個人就要保證做對的人。我不想犯錯誤。
AW：全都接下來，你不可能犯錯的。你真的很棒。你想到過你會成為一名歌手嗎？
MJ：我不記得我有不唱歌的時候，所以我也就從來沒有夢想過唱歌。
AW：你還收集衣服嗎？有沒有好的設計師？
MJ：事實上，除非是要上臺，我對那些沒多大興趣。我惟一搜集的只有演出服和海盜服，或是類似的東西。對於日常的時尚我不感興趣。
AW：你穿什麼？
MJ：現在我穿著一條條絨褲子，膝蓋上還有個大洞，還穿一件粉色襯衣，還有領結。
AW：你常出門嗎？還是待在家裏？
MJ：我待在家裏。
AW：你幹嗎待在家裏？外頭的世界很精彩。等你到紐約來，我們帶你出去。
MJ：只有在紐約我才會想出去走走。
MJ：你去看電影嗎？
MJ：哦，是的。我們正要做一張關於《ET》的專輯。我還和ET有一張合影，這太棒了！（照片裏）他抱著我。
AW：我喜歡《電子世界爭霸戰》，看戲來就像玩電子遊戲。你看過嗎？
MJ：看過，但它沒打動我。
AW：好吧。謝謝你，回頭見。
MJ：回頭見。如果你見到Liza，代我問好，給她一個大大的吻和擁抱。
（AW掛斷電話）
BC：你喜歡滾石樂隊嗎？你到底認不認識米克（賈格）？
MJ：我在廁所裏見到他。他和基斯在一起——基斯穆恩？
BC：基斯理查茲。
MJ：基斯理查茲。我走進去然後說：“哦，嗨。”然後我們就開始交談，我的節目要開始了就走開了。我和他不是很熟。
BC：你經常看書嗎？
MJ：是的。我喜歡閱讀。我喜歡哲學和短篇小說。我喜歡跟上最新的暢銷書。《洛杉磯時報》的星期日日曆是我最喜歡的報紙。它能讓你瞭解所有地方的事情。我還有最喜歡的作者——這並不是說我只看暢銷書，我喜歡瞭解他們在幹什麼，並跟上人們的興趣點。這和心理有很大關係。
BC：你鍛煉嗎？
MJ：每個周日我會不停歇地跳30分鐘舞。我很享受。
BC：為什麼是周日？
MJ：我只是選了周日而已。每個周日我還禁食。不吃任何東西，只喝果汁。
BC：你幹嘛要那麼做？
MJ：那樣能洗刷身體系統，清潔結腸。我覺得很棒。要想真正達到效果，你得正確實行才行。這是身體系統的排汙閥，你必須就像保持外表清潔一樣保持身體的內部清潔。如果你的體內不清潔，身體系統上就會出現不純淨的種種問題，通過發痘痘、得病或者毛孔粗大體現出來，那是毒素在跑出你的體外。人們應該保持自身的清潔。
BC：你不看報紙的頭版吧？
MJ：不看。我也許會瞄上一眼，但不會去讀。
BC：太令人沮喪了？
MJ：是的。上面永遠都是那些東西。我喜歡讓人快樂，那也是演藝事業最偉大之處。那是一種出逃：你花五塊錢進去坐下，然後就完全置身於另外一個世界了，忘記了世界上所有的煩惱。那太奇妙了。那就是魔法。
INTERVIEW MAGAZINE 1982 The Very Private World Of Michael Jackson By Andy Warhol And Bob Colacello Friday, August 20, 1982, 3:30 P.M. Somewhere In The San Fernando Valley . Bob Colacello Arrives At The Condominium That Michael Jackson And His Family Are Temporarily Renting While Their House Nearby Is Being Redecorated. Michael, Who Everyone Remembers As The Boy Lead Singer Of The Jackson Five, Has Built A Solid Solo Career For Himself . His Last Album, ‘Off The Wall’ Has Sold Over 5 Million Copies In The U.S. Alone. Though He Also Still Records With His Brothers, Now Known As The Jacksons, Michael Has Branched Out To Work With Such Superstars As Paul Mccartney, Quincy Jones, Diana Ross And Steven Spielberg, All Of Whom Are Close Friends. While Waiting For A Phone Call From Andy Warhol In New York , Bc And Mj Began Chatting About Another Close Friend, Jane Fonda.
Michael Jackson: The night that Henry Fonda died, I went over there and I was with the family. They were talking and watching all the different news pieces. Although her father died, Jane was still able to show an interest in my career, asking me have I gotten the film yet, and I thought that was very sweet. I think that they had been expecting him to die for so long. Months and months and months ago she was talking as though it was going to be any day. It happened and there were tears sometimes and laughter sometimes and they ate a little.
Bob Colacello: So what are you doing? Have you gotten a movie to do?
MJ: Well, right now I’m just finishing up the album [Thriller ? Ed.] and concentrating on that. I’m doing the other album as well, the E.T. album, at the same time. That album is a little new for me because I’ve never narrated a story.
BC: What is the E.T. album?
MJ: It’s a storybook album, a double album and I’m narrating the whole story and singing the song which we have to come up with and write. We’ve been just meeting and talking about it with Steven [Spielberg] for I don’t know how long? Getting together and talking about making it the all-time storybook album.
BC: The album you’re doing, you’ve written everything on it?
MJ: I’ve written four or five songs.
BC: Steve [Rubell] told me you’re doing something with Paul McCartney?
MJ: Yes. Paul was just here and a song I wrote called The Girl Is Mine, we sing together on my album. We’re fighting over this girl in the song and it came out beautifully both his album, we wrote and sang two songs together, his ‘Tug ‘O War Part II.’ But for mine it’s the song that I wrote. There’s a rap at the end where we’re fighting over her. It’s funny.
BC: You’re very open to working with other stars. Very often people aren’t.
MJ: I’m not actually. Not at all.
BC: You worked with Diana Ross?
MJ: Only very special people. I mean, Diana’s like a mother-lover-friend to me. She’s wonderful. I just wrote, produced and edited her next single, Muscles.
BC: Did you write the lyrics, too?
MJ: Lyrics, music - I just finished that and it should be coming out at the end of this month.
BC: Where do you find the time to do all this writing?
MJ: On airplanes. I was coming back from England working on Paul McCartney’s album, zooming along on the Concorde, and this song popped into my head. I said, ‘Hey, that’s perfect for Diana!’ I didn’t have a tape recorder or anything so I had to suffer for like three hours. Soon as I got home I whipped that baby on tape.
BC: Do you care about politics at all.
MJ: I don’t like talking about it.
BC: You don’t get into that at all with Jane [Fonda]?
MJ: No, we do. She’s wonderful. She teaches me all kinds of stuff. When I was on the ‘Golden Pond’ set I stayed with Jane in the cabin and we were all alone there on the water and we’d just talk, talk, talk about everything. It was the greatest education for me – she’d learn and I’d learn and we’d just play off of each other. We talked about all kinds of things, you name it: politics, philosophers, racism, Vietnam , acting, all kinds of things. It was magic.
BC: Where were you educated, because you were always on the road?
MJ: Private schools or tutors.
BC: You come from Gary , Indiana ? What was it like growing up there?
MJ: Actually, I was so small I don’t remember. When I was five I was touring, singing and dancing. Always gone, always out of school. I just remember little things like the corner store or certain people in the neighborhood. The high school behind us always had a big band with trumpets and trombones and drums coming down the street - I used to love that - like a parade. That’s all I remember.
BC: Did you like performing as a child? Did you always love it?
MJ: Always did. I always enjoyed the feeling of being on stage - the magic that comes. When I hit the stage it’s like all of a sudden a magic from somewhere just comes and the spirit just hits you and you just lose control of yourself. I came on stage at Quincy’s [Jones] concert at the Rose Bowl and I did not want to go on stage. I was ducking and hiding and hoping he wouldn’t see me hiding behind people when he called me on. Then I went up there and I just went crazy. I started climbing up the scaffold, the speakers, the light gear. The audience started getting into it and I started dancing and singing and that’s what happens.
BC: How do you compare acting to performing on the stage?
MJ: I love both. Acting is the cream of the crop. I love performing. It’s a phenomenal getaway. If you want to really let out everything you feel, that’s the time to do it. With acting, it’s like becoming another person. I think that’s neat, especially when you totally forget. If you totally forget, which I love to do, that’s when it’s magic. I love to create magic - to put something together that’s so unusual, so unexpected that it blows people’s heads off. Something ahead of the times. Five steps ahead of what people are thinking. So people see it and say, ‘Whoa, I wasn’t expecting that.’ I love surprising people with a present or a gift or a stage performance or anything. I love John Travolta, who came off that ‘Kotter’ show. Nobody knew he could dance or do all those things. He is like - boom. Before he knew it, he was the next big Brando or something.
BC: He hasn’t done much lately.
MJ: I know. I think he’s choosing scripts and stuff. It’s always difficult for anyone trying to compete against their past achievements.
BC: Tell me, who do you think has made breakthroughs in their work in any field?
MJ: I love Steven Spielberg so much. I just love James Brown. He’s phenomenal. I’ve never seen a performer create electricity with an audience like James Brown. He’s got everybody in his hands and whatever he wants to do with them, he does it. It’s amazing. I’ve always thought he was underrated. I love Sammy Davis Jr., I love Fred Astaire. I love George Lucas. I’m crazy about Jane Fonda and Katharine Hepburn.
BC: I saw a picture of you with Katharine Hepburn on the set of On Golden Pond.
MJ: I feel honored to know her because there are a lot of people she doesn’t like – she’ll tell you right away if she doesn’t like you. When I first met her, I was a little shaky because you hear things about her - Jane filled me in. I was kind of scared. But, right away, she invited me to dinner that day. Ever since then we’ve been friends. She came to our concert - the first concert she had ever been to - at the [ Madison Square ] Garden, and she just enjoyed herself. We call each other on the phone and she sends me letters. She’s just wonderful. I went to her house in New York and she showed me Spencer Tracy’s favorite chair and his private things in his closet, his little knick-knacks. I think he’s just magic.
BC: Are you a fan of old movies?
MJ: Oh, yes. There was a lot of great art, great acting, great directing, great stories. When it comes to stuff like ‘Captains Courageous’ or ‘Boys’ Town’, ‘Father Flanagan,’ ‘Woman of the Year’ that stuff is unreal.
BC: Why don’t you write a story of your own?
MJ: That’s what we’re working on right now. We’re kind of fooling with it, Quincy and Steven and I - hopefully we’ll be able to do something with it. Steven wants to do a musical.
BC: Would you like to do Broadway?
MJ: Not yet. I think it’s good for sharpening your skills. It’s the best for really reaching the zenith of your talent. You go so far and reach the peak of it and you say, ‘Maybe this is the best performance I can do.’ What’s so sad about the whole thing is that you don’t capture that moment. Look at how many great actors or entertainers have been lost to the world because they did a performance one night and that was it. With film, you capture that, it’s shown all over the world and it’s there forever. Spencer Tracy will always be young in Captains Courageous and I can learn and be stimulated by his performance. So much is lost in theater, so much. Or vaudeville. Do you know what I could have learned by watching all those entertainers? It would be unreal.
BC: Most plays are videotaped now, but not every night.
MJ: That’s the thing. The actor’s tense, he’s being taped and things are not falling naturally. That’s what I hate about Broadway. I feel I’m giving a whole lot for nothing. I like to capture things and hold them there and share them with the whole world. BC: It seems that what really motivates you is your desire to entertain people, to please people. What about fame and money? Could you imagine not being famous or does being famous bother you?
MJ: It never has bothered me except sometimes when you want peace. Like you go to the theater and you say, ‘Nobody’s bothering me tonight, I’m wearing my hat and glasses and I’m going to enjoy this film and that’s all there is to it.’ You get in there and everybody’s watching and staring at you and at the climax of the film somebody taps you on the shoulder for an autograph. You just feel like you can’t get away.
BC: Is that why you live out here in the Valley as opposed to Beverly Hills where all the other stars live?
MJ: Yes, but it’s just as bad. Beverly Hills is worse because they go there looking for them.
BC: You’re very close to you parents. Do they live out here in L.A. ?
MJ: Yes. My mother’s upstairs. My father’s at the office.
BC: What’s your typical day like?
MJ: Daydreaming most of the day. I get up early and get ready for whatever I’ve got to do, songwriting or whatever it is. Planning the future and stuff.
BC: Are you optimistic about the future?
MJ: Yes, I always like to plan ahead of time and follow up.
BC: Liza Minnelli’s a friend of yours, isn’t she?
MJ: How could I forget her? I’m crazy about Liza. Add her to that list of my favorite people. I just love her to death. We get on the phone and we just gossip, gossip, gossip. What I like about Liza is that when we get together it’s all show talk. I show her my favorite steps and she shows me hers. She’s a show-stopping performer, too. She has real charisma. In the future I’d like to record her. I think a person like her should be heard on the radio and accepted and that whole thing. She’s magic on stage.
BC: Do you care about fashion much?
MJ: No. I care about what I wear on stage. You know what I love, though? I don’t care about everyday clothes. I love putting on an outfit or a costume and just looking at myself in the mirror. Baggy pants or some real funky shoes and a hat and just feeling the character of it. That’s fun to me.
BC: You like to act a lot just in everyday life?
MJ: I love it so much. It’s escape. It’s fun. It’s just neat to become another thing, another person. Especially when you really believe it and it’s not like you’re acting. I always hated the word ‘acting’ to say, ‘I’m an actor.’ It should be more than that. It should be more like a believer.
BC: But isn’t that a little frightening when you believe it totally?
MJ: No, that’s what I love about it. I just like to really forget.
BC: Why do you want to forget so much? Do you think life is really hard?
MJ: No, maybe it’s because I just like jumping in other people’s lives and exploring. Like Charlie Chaplin. I just love him to death. The little tramp, the whole gear and everything, and his heart - everything he portrayed on the screen was a truism. It was his whole life. He was born in London , and his father died an alcoholic when he was six. His mother was in an insane asylum. He roamed the streets of England , begging, poor, hungry. All this reflects on the screen and that’s what I like to do, to bring all of those truths out.
BC: Do you care about making money?
MJ: I care about being paid fairly for what I do. When I approach a project, I put my whole heart and soul in it. Because I really care about it, I put everything I’ve got into it and I want to be paid. The guy who works should eat. It’s that simple.
BC: You follow your own business very closely then?
MJ: Oh, yes.
BC: How old are you?
MJ: Twenty-three.
BC: Do you sometimes feel as though you missed out on childhood because you’ve always been performing in the adult world?
MJ: Sometimes.
BC: But you like people older than yourself, experienced people
MJ: I love experienced people. I love people who are phenomenally talented. I love people who’ve worked so hard and been so courageous and are the leaders in their fields. For me to meet somebody like that and learn from them, and share words with them - to me that’s magic. To work together. I’m crazy about Steven Spielberg. Another inspiration for me, and I don’t know where it came from, is children. If I’m down, I’ll take a book with children’s pictures and look at it and it will just lift me up. Being around children is magic.
BC: There is something positive and encouraging about them. You have a lot of animals don’t you?
MJ: I used to. Right now I only have two baby deer, one’s a boy and one’s a girl. They’re so sweet. They’re gorgeous.
BC: I’ll never understand how people can shoot deer.
MJ: I hate it. I hate taxidermy shops and all that crap. I have a llama. I have a sheep - he looks just like a ram with the horns. Louie is from the circus. He’s the llama. The ram is called Mr. Tibbs and the fawns are Prince and Princess.
BC: What are you going to do with them when they grow?
MJ: Let them go in the yard and stuff. We have just about two acres.
BC: What kind of car do you have?
MJ: A Rolls. A black one.
BC: Do you like driving it?
MJ: I never wanted to drive. My parents forced me to drive. Quincy doesn’t drive. A lot of people I know don’t drive.
BC: Andy [Warhol] doesn’t drive.
MJ: That’s smart. But it’s good when you want a little independence to get away. But I don’t go many places. I don’t know many places. I just drive down the street.
BC: You don’t go out much?
MJ: Only to go to the Golden Temple , a health food restaurant. I’m a vegetarian. Or I go to the arcade and play the games.
BC: Are you interested in art?
MJ: I love to draw - pencil, ink pen - I love art. When I go on tour and visit museums in Holland , Germany or England - you know those huge paintings? I’m just amazed. You don’t think a painter could do something like that. I can look at a piece of sculpture or a painting and totally lose myself in it. Standing there watching it and becoming part of the scene. It can draw tears, it can touch you so much. See, that’s where I think the actor or performer should be - to touch that truth inside of the person. Touch that reality so much that they become a part of what you’re doing and you can take them anywhere you want to. You’re happy, they’re happy. Whatever the human emotion, they’re right there with you. I love realism. I don’t like plastics. Deep down inside we’re all the same. We all have the same emotions and that’s why a film like E.T. touches everybody. Who doesn’t want to fly like Peter Pan? Who doesn’t want to fly with some magic creature from outer space and be friends with him? Steven went straight to the heart. He knows - when in doubt, go for the heart.
BC: You’re religious, aren’t you?
MJ: Yes. I believe in the Bible and I believe in God whose name is Jehovah and that whole thing.
BC: Someone said that’s why you don’t shave.
MJ: Oh no! I don’t grow anything to shave. That’s got nothing to do with it.
BC: So you’re just a basic Christian.
MJ: I believe in truth.
BC: Do you read the Bible?
MJ: Yes, a lot.
BC: Do you go to church.
MJ: We don’t call it church. It’s Kingdom Hall. It’s Jehovah’s Witnesses.
BC: You mentioned that you are going to see Bette Midler tomorrow? Are you working on something together?
MJ: No, I go to this guy named Seth Riggs. When I sing, I like to get my voice all opened up - like a dancer warming up.
BC: So, it’s like breathing classes?
MJ: Right. And right after I do mine, in she comes. She’s always on time.
(Andy Warhol calls from New York )
ANDY WARHOL: Hello?
MJ: Hi.
AW: Gosh, this is exciting. You know, every time I use my Walkman I play your cassette on it.
MJ: Have you seen Liza lately?
AW: Yes, I did. She was in Europe but then I saw her at Halston’s fashion show. She changed her hairdo. Her hair looks more like yours now. It’s really curly in the front and she looks really different and it’s really pretty. She has a great new look. She went out to Halston’s last weekend and she’s in New York right now. How have you been?
MJ: I’ve been in the studio a lot, writing lyrics and working on songs and stuff.
AW: I might go see an English rock group at the Ritz tonight called Duran Duran. Do you know them?
MJ: No.
AW: I went to see Blondie at the Meadowlands last week.
MJ: How was Blondie?
AW: She was great. She’s so terrific. Do you know her?
MJ: No, I never met her.
AW: Well, when you come to New York I’ll introduce her. Going on tour is about the hardest thing to do in the world.
MJ: Tour is something - the pacing. But being on the stage is the most magic thing about it.
AW: I can’t wait until you do a really big movie. Have they asked you to do anything?
MJ: My room is loaded with scripts and offers. And a lot of them are great ideas. But the kind of person I am is that I have a person in mind that I’d like to work with and I’m trying to make sure I do the right thing. I just don’t want to make a mistake.
AW: Just do them all. You can’t make a mistake. You’re really good. Did you ever think you’d grow up to be a singer?
MJ: I don’t ever remember not singing, so I never dreamed of singing.
AW: Are you still collecting clothes? Do you have a good designer?
MJ: Actually, I don’t really get into that unless I’m going on stage. The only thing I like collecting is costumes or pirate coats or things like that. But everyday fashion I don’t get into.
AW: What do you wear?
MJ: Right now I have on corduroy pants with a big hole in the knee and a pink shirt and tie.
AW: Do you go out a lot or stay home?
MJ: I stay home.
AW: Why do you stay home? There’s so much fun out. When you come to New York we’ll take you out.
MJ: The only time I want to go out is when I’m in New York .
AW: Do you go to movies?
MJ: Oh, yes. We’re going to be working on the E.T. album. I had a picture session with E.T. and it was so wonderful. He’s hugging me and everything.
AW: I like Tron. It’s like playing the video games. Have you seen it?
MJ: Yes. It didn’t move me.
AW: Well, thanks a lot. See you soon.
MJ: I hope so. If you see Liza, say hello. Give her a big kiss and hug for me.
(AW signs off)
BC: Do you like the Rolling Stones? Do you know Mick at all?
MJ: I met him in a bathroom. He was in there with Keith - Keith Moon?
BC: Keith Richards.
MJ: Keith Richards. I came in there and said, ‘Oh, hi,’ and we just started talking. Then I just went back into my session. I don’t really know him that well.
BC: Do you read a lot?
MJ: Yes. I love to read. I like philosophy and short stories. I like to keep up with the latest best-sellers. The Calendar in the Sunday L.A. Times is my favorite paper. It really lets you know what’s going on everywhere. I have my favorite authors – it’s not like I just read the best-sellers. I like to see what they are doing and keep up with what people are interested in. There’s a lot of physical stuff now.
BC: Do you exercise?
MJ: Every Sunday I dance for 30 minutes straight without stopping. I love to do that.
BC: Why Sunday?
MJ: That’s just the day I pick. Like I fast every Sunday. I don’t eat anything. Just juices.
BC: Why do you do that?
MJ: It flushes out the system, cleans out the colon. I think that’s great. To really make it work you have to do it properly. That’s the sewer valve of the system. You have to keep that clean like you clean the outside of your body. All these impurities come out of your system because you’re not clean inside. It comes out in pimples or disease or through big pores. Toxins trying to get out of your system. People should try to keep themselves clean.
BC: You don’t read page one of the newspaper?
MJ: No. I might look at it but I won’t read it.
BC: Too depressing?
MJ: Yes. It’s always the same old thing. I like to make people happy. That’s what’s great about show business. It’s escapism. You pay your five bucks to get in and sit there and you’re in another world. Forget about the problems in the world. It’s wonderful. It’s entertaining. It’s magic.
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